View Full Version : US KILLING CIVILIANS LEAKED VIDEO
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rXPrfnU3G0&feature=player_embedded
Shows Americans killing journalists, civilians, and injuring two children severely.
Perhaps it wasn't intentional. Perhaps they really thought those cameras were rifles. But they weren't engaging in combat in any way. And they slaughtered them like animals
Hey cool, you posted this as soon as I was about to post this.
Reuters demanded this video released a few months ago, it took the US military that long to release it.
"Let us shoot! Come on!" Meanwhile you can see the kids in the van, clearly.
And clearly, if you go around saving people who got shot from the sky, your punishment warrants death....clearly.
"Oh well, it's their fault for bringing their kids to a battle"
Sickening.
Jesse the Great Tsar
05-Apr-10, 17:50
The cameras though, looked alot like AT weaponry.
The first engagement was understandable, but the second...
I have to say, those aviators were pretty noob...
Hey cool, you posted this as soon as I was about to post this.
Reuters demanded this video released a few months ago, it took the US military that long to release it.
"Let us shoot! Come on!" Meanwhile you can see the kids in the van, clearly.
And clearly, if you go around saving people who got shot from the sky, your punishment warrants death....clearly.
"Oh well, it's their fault for bringing their kids to a battle"
Sickening.
If you go to help the "bad guy" after he gets shot, you look like a bad guy.
The cameras though, looked alot like AT weaponry.
The first engagement was understandable, but the second...
I have to say, those aviators were pretty noob...
I can tell from that video that they clearly weren't carrying an RPG, or even a rifle.
If I can tell, then it's pretty worrysome that our military can't.
If you go to help the "bad guy" after he gets shot, you look like a bad guy.
God forbid you try to help somebody. Regardless if they're a "bad guy" or not.
Jesse the Great Tsar
05-Apr-10, 18:22
I can tell from that video that they clearly weren't carrying an RPG, or even a rifle.
If I can tell, then it's pretty worrysome that our military can't.
God forbid you try to help somebody. Regardless if they're a "bad guy" or not.
At times, it looked ALOT like an RPG. BTW...
HINDSIGHT IS 20/20
Jesse the Great Tsar
05-Apr-10, 18:24
God forbid you try to help somebody. Regardless if they're a "bad guy" or not.
It is questionable enough, but probably not to fire.
Thrasher9294
05-Apr-10, 19:05
OH GOD ITS A WAR AND ONE RETARDED PERSON IN THE MILITARY KILLED SOMEONE WITH WHAT LOOKED LIKE THEY MIGHT HAVE BEEN CARRYING A WEAPON THEYRE THE EVILEST COUNTRY EVER I MEAN WHY WOULD THEY EVER SHOOT ANYONE IN A COUNTRY FULL OF PEOPLE WHO KILL THEM WHEN THEY MIGHT NOT BE SO EVILE
Jesse the Great Tsar
05-Apr-10, 19:10
If only the wore a shirt that said PRESS on it...
LoveHateHero329
05-Apr-10, 19:28
My argument siding with the pilots:
It's a hostile area known for Insurgents, under the stress of combat I see what appears to be assholes that shoot and kill my friends I would want to kill.
Argument against:
Why did they shoot when they weren't being fired upon, and wtf is up with the second shooting on the van and the civilians trying to help?
I understand the first engagement, as I can see how they may have looked like they were holding rifles, and one guy was crouching down by a wall with his camera but as only the tip was hanging out, it looked a bit like an RPG. The second engagement was just wrong.
OH GOD ITS A WAR AND ONE RETARDED PERSON IN THE MILITARY KILLED SOMEONE WITH WHAT LOOKED LIKE THEY MIGHT HAVE BEEN CARRYING A WEAPON THEYRE THE EVILEST COUNTRY EVER I MEAN WHY WOULD THEY EVER SHOOT ANYONE IN A COUNTRY FULL OF PEOPLE WHO KILL THEM WHEN THEY MIGHT NOT BE SO EVILE
An innocent death is an innocent death.
It's for engagements like this that the world hates our guts, we do this all the time across the world. Just look at the Predators in Afghanistan, they kill dozens of innocent people at a time and the military is just like "whoops, our bad".
The US miliyary is careless, they gun down 12 people, and then when the find out they were civilians, it's always "our bad, sorry" and then back to more killing. It's hopeless.
President Camacho
06-Apr-10, 00:01
to be honest, this shit happens, the guys behind the guns are retards. but what sickens me the most, and needs to stop, is the lies and cover-up.
the military can say those things and get away with them because nobody ever asks questions. it only took one person to ask for the truth and this is what we get, trigger happy moron kids murdering people from the sky, if and there's nothing we can do about it. they are the ones with the guns, we can just watch as they destroy the world.
I'm not Goro this time
06-Apr-10, 02:52
Sure, cameras might look like weaponry. But aiming at unarmed civilians and saying "Come on! Grab a gun so we can shoot!" is just wrong.
Reuters demanded this video released a few months ago, it took the US military that long to release it.
The sad thing is, the military didn't even release this officially. It was someone in the US military who gave the encrypted video to Wikileaks who decrypted it and released it to the public as they had promised ~ a week before.
Here's a video with the co-founder of Wikileaks on MSNBC discussing the video and a guy in the military who completely defended their actions, except for killing the wounded guy because "they should have captured and interrogated him." It's quite an interesting discussion.
Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5d3SHumK2UY
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OcdEcndn85g
Note the part where the co-founder of Wikileaks says they have a video of the US bombing NINETY-SEVEN civilians in Afghanistan which they're to release shortly. It's a sad, sad world...
Taepodong-2
06-Apr-10, 09:42
I'm pretty sure there's also a video floating around somewhere that has an AC-130 attacking a mosque during a wedding.
Jesse the Great Tsar
06-Apr-10, 09:42
The US miliyary is careless, they gun down 12 people, and then when the find out they were civilians, it's always "our bad, sorry" and then back to more killing. It's hopeless.
Your grammar is careless...
But may I remind you that friesdly armor was within a 100-300 yds, away and these people had some over the shoulder weapon. The van engagement walks a fine line between caring and foolishness (The people who helped).
But crap hits the fan on a day to day basis everywhere.
True true, and on the Ac-130 topic, that was actually a proper engagement, and the inspiration for the Call of Duty 4 mission "Death From Above".
Jesse the Great Tsar
06-Apr-10, 11:12
True true, and on the Ac-130 topic, that was actually a proper engagement, and the inspiration for the Call of Duty 4 mission "Death From Above".
Wasn't there a church in that mission?
Wasn't there a church in that mission?
Yes, it bares much resemblance to the real video, including the callsign of the AC-130 being "Wildfire".
Thrasher9294
06-Apr-10, 13:07
I LOVE GUNS AND SHOOTING GAMES BUT REAL LIFE WAR PEOPLE ARE JERKS
I'm not Goro this time
06-Apr-10, 13:32
I LOVE GUNS AND SHOOTING GAMES BUT REAL LIFE WAR PEOPLE ARE JERKS
Well, no shit. There's a big difference between pushing buttons while yelling at twelve year-olds and killing actual people.
Well, no shit. There's a big difference between pushing buttons while yelling at twelve year-olds and killing actual people.
There is?
There is?
Not to the US military it seems...
Thrasher9294
06-Apr-10, 17:17
no russian
Well when I watched the footage, looking through the chopper gunner's camera, then hearing the cannon go off and such, it really felt like an MW2 Chopper Gunner!
Snuffy the Evil
06-Apr-10, 18:25
Sickeningly unprofessional. I can understand how the situation came about, but the conduct of the Apache's crew is disgusting.
Well when I watched the footage, looking through the chopper gunner's camera, then hearing the cannon go off and such, it really felt like an MW2 Chopper Gunner!
Except, you know, people are actually FUCKING DEAD.
Sickeningly unprofessional. I can understand how the situation came about, but the conduct of the Apache's crew is disgusting.
Except, you know, people are actually FUCKING DEAD.
Indeed, and I fully understand that, also, the graphics were much better than MW2!
Jesse the Great Tsar
06-Apr-10, 21:25
Here's the WHOLE story:
David Finkel: "Hi everyone. Thanks for joining this chat. We got to see an edited version yesterday of a disturbing video showing what one day in the surge was like. Since I happened to be there that day, I thought I'd try to put the video in fuller context. I'm looking forward to your questions...
What's helpful to understand is that, contrary to some interpretations that this was an attack on some people walking down the street on a nice day, the day was anyting but that. It happened in the midst of a large operation to clear an area where US soldiers had been getting shot at, injured, and killed with increasing frequency. What the Reuters guys walked into was the very worst part, where the morning had been a series of RPG attacks and running gun battles...
If you were to see the full video, you would see a person carrying an RPG launcher as he walkeddown the street as part of the group. Another was armed as well, as I recall. Also, if you had the unfortunate luck to be on site afterwards, you would have seen that one of the dead in the group was lying on top of a launcher. Because of that and some other things, EOD -- the Hurt Locker guys, I guess -- had to come in and secure the site. And again, I'm not trying to excuse what happened. But there was more to it for you to consider than what was in the released video."
And for more insight:
http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/201889.php
This is how close the group was to friendlies via the picture on there camera:
http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/us_murder_reuters_humvee.jpg
I'm not Goro this time
07-Apr-10, 02:33
Indeed, and I fully understand that, also, the graphics were much better than MW2!
Holy fuck you're so edgy and cool.
Thrasher9294
07-Apr-10, 09:27
Holy fuck you're so edgy and cool.
WOW GORO TROLLED HARD
I'm not Goro this time
07-Apr-10, 10:13
WOW GORO TROLLED HARD
Not trolling. Mantis just keeps comparing this to a video game to be funny, which is completely inappropriate considering this is a pretty sensitive subject we're talking about.
MerX Back 91
07-Apr-10, 12:34
So apparenty the camera looks just like an RPG and messenge bags look like Ak-47s. Disgusting. I can understand the situation, but the gunner was like "c'mon, let me shoot" and way too eager to blow them up. That's not in the RoE of the US Army, I believe they have to be actually hostile for you do do shit.
Not trolling. Mantis just keeps comparing this to a video game to be funny, which is completely inappropriate considering this is a pretty sensitive subject we're talking about.
I only compared it as a one time deal, but people grabbed onto it, so I went a bit further. I fully understand this is a sensitive situation, and I also understand it is fully real. I also personally believe that the simple fact the gunner goaded a wounded man to pick up a gun so he could rain down 30mm on him is sickening, and puts a nasty image on the US Army. I understand if the gunner is serious, but he's treating it like MW2, wanting to just shoot shoot shoot till the cows come home. And continually requesting to engage the van until he got clearance, even more sickening.
God dammit, Kyle.
South Park reference?
Jesse the Great Tsar
07-Apr-10, 18:16
You guys do know that there were multiple RPG launchers and rounds at the site? You do know that friendlies were a block away? Did you know that I already posted what happened on the first page?
You guys do know that there were multiple RPG launchers and rounds at the site? You do know that friendlies were a block away? Did you know that I already posted what happened on the first page?
I know, but still, not like they were firing RPGs at the Apaches.
Jesse the Great Tsar
07-Apr-10, 18:19
I know, but still, not like they were firing RPGs at the Apaches.
So the Apaches let the men fire on friendlies within a block or 2?
So the Apaches let the men fire on friendlies within a block or 2?
True, a case could be made for that, as an RPG will do work on a Humvee. so I can see your point now, fire on them or let friendlies be fired upon, makes sense.
Yeah, because it's not like they were casually walking down the fucking street or anything. They broke the ROEs.
President Camacho
08-Apr-10, 00:40
I laugh whenever someone mentions ROEs. I hope you realize that these so called ROEs are laws we put in place to force an already destabilized area into a police state, but instead of arrests, we shoot to kill.
who here knows what police states make? that's right, freedom fighters, and these guys who pick up guns and shoot at us don't hate our freedom, they hate that we took theirs. however the fact that people are willing to fight for their beliefs allows the US to stay in the region and reap all the material benefits.
keep in mind there is no such thing as an organized terrorist organization in the middle east, unless you count the army.
Jesse the Great Tsar
08-Apr-10, 01:27
I laugh whenever someone mentions ROEs. I hope you realize that these so called ROEs are laws we put in place to force an already destabilized area into a police state, but instead of arrests, we shoot to kill.
who here knows what police states make? that's right, freedom fighters, and these guys who pick up guns and shoot at us don't hate our freedom, they hate that we took theirs. however the fact that people are willing to fight for their beliefs allows the US to stay in the region and reap all the material benefits.
keep in mind there is no such thing as an organized terrorist organization in the middle east, unless you count the army.
ROEs are in EVERY single war....
ROEs are in EVERY single war....
Indeed, as far as I know.
President Camacho
08-Apr-10, 11:09
ROEs are in EVERY single war....
this isn't a war though, it's an occupation. hell even the military calls it a conflict because it isn't a war.
this isn't a war though, it's an occupation. hell even the military calls it a conflict because it isn't a war.
Again, a good point, I've always said the NATO occupations of Afghanistan and Iraq are conflicts, but not wars by any means.
MerX Back 91
09-Apr-10, 10:17
U) Rules of Engagement.
..................
1.(U) Deadly force may be used only when--
(a) (U) Fired upon.
(b) (U) Clear evidence of hostile intent exists (see above for factors to consider to determine hostile intent).
(c) (U) Armed elements, mobs, and/or rioters threaten human life, sensitive equipment and aircraft, and open and free passage of relief supplies.
2.(U) In situations where deadly force is not appropriate, use the minimum force necessary to accomplish the mission.
.................................................. ..................
(c) (U) Warning shots aimed to prevent harm to either innocent civilians or the opposing force
Hmm... no warning shots. No one was fired upon. There was no CLEAR evidence of hostile intent. There were no mobs...
Looks like a violation to me, but whatever you say cause you're so smart.
I laugh whenever someone mentions ROEs. I hope you realize that these so called ROEs are laws we put in place to force an already destabilized area into a police state, but instead of arrests, we shoot to kill.
who here knows what police states make? that's right, freedom fighters, and these guys who pick up guns and shoot at us don't hate our freedom, they hate that we took theirs. however the fact that people are willing to fight for their beliefs allows the US to stay in the region and reap all the material benefits.
keep in mind there is no such thing as an organized terrorist organization in the middle east, unless you count the army.
I agree wholeheartedly.
In other news, this kinda sucks:
"During the course of my three tours, the rules of engagement changed a lot," Washburn's testimony continued, "The higher the threat the more viciously we were permitted and expected to respond. Something else we were encouraged to do, almost with a wink and nudge, was to carry 'drop weapons', or by my third tour, 'drop shovels'. We would carry these weapons or shovels with us because if we accidentally shot a civilian, we could just toss the weapon on the body, and make them look like an insurgent."
...
"One time they said to fire on all taxicabs because the enemy was using them for transportation.... One of the snipers replied back, 'Excuse me? Did I hear that right? Fire on all taxicabs?' The lieutenant colonel responded, 'You heard me, trooper, fire on all taxicabs.' After that, the town lit up, with all the units firing on cars. This was my first experience with war, and that kind of set the tone for the rest of the deployment."
Man, I remember a day when Rules of Engagement used to mean something, nowadays it's a fucking wild west out there!
President Camacho
09-Apr-10, 19:30
Man, I remember a day when Rules of Engagement used to mean something, nowadays it's a fucking wild west out there!
you mean Wild sort-of-east?
Thrasher9294
09-Apr-10, 20:46
I think it's bullshit that things should get Politically Correct in a War like this.
you mean Wild sort-of-east?
Wild Middle East!
President Camacho
10-Apr-10, 23:30
Wild Middle East!
starring Havil Schmidt, Khalid Kholm, and Saahirah Hayek
starring Havil Schmidt, Khalid Kholm, and Saahirah Hayek
with a special appearance by Osama Bin Laden!
with a special appearance by Osama Bin Laden!
Not possible. He's been dead for years.
Not possible. He's been dead for years.
My thoughts exactly, but don't tell the US government, they're still looking for him!
MerX Back 91
30-May-10, 22:56
Hmm.... lets invade Canada and kill mantis.
I'm not Goro this time
31-May-10, 06:34
Hmm.... lets invade Canada and kill mantis.
I know! Let's bump a month-old thread.
MerX Back 91
31-May-10, 11:28
Sounds fun!
President Camacho
31-May-10, 13:26
i'm still a little miffed that nobody thought havil schmidt was funny.
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